08 September 2017 @ 12:19 pm
foreigners  
watched a youtube video about an american lady in japan... okay, good, she's at least learning japanese. comments that this video (with a japanese person) is in english "so that you guys can all understand" etc, i'm okay with that. no idea how long she's been in japan but it seems like at least a few years, based on some stuff she said.

BUT.

then she said stuff like "sometimes there's kanji i don't know on the menu and google translate doesn't help". what was one of the kanji she didn't know? freaking HORSE MEAT. 馬肉. i fully understand there being kanji you don't know but if your level is so low that you don't know "horse" and "meat" you need to stop talking as if you're good at japanese... these are kanji you learn (or should learn) in your first year of studies.

in some ways "westerners" in japan are waaaay better than those i've seen anywhere else (you are, after all, going to a country and language completely different from the rest of the world in daily life in a lot of ways so it takes a certain kind of person to stay and live there), but then there's still plenty of normal ones that are left. i really REALLY do not want to be around these people. i don't want to be influenced by someone who still can't speak japanese or still doesn't eat japanese food after 10 years of living in japan. i don't want to look up, realize a year has passed and the majority of my company has been foreigners so we've taught each other language and culture mistakes and never experienced, well, japan for real.... that's not what i'm going to japan for.

i keep being weak and thinking i'm being too harsh. they're still just people, it's not their fault they're foreign, if they're nice then it's fine to be around them etc etc. buuuuuuut no, i have to stop that, that's falling into their trap...
 
 
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Alice • アリス[personal profile] ocean on September 10th, 2017 07:02 pm (UTC)
She's been living in Japan for how long, and she still doesn't know basic kanji? (I know 馬 is supposed to be N3-level kanji, but both that and 肉 are such common words that she should know them anyway...) I can understand forgetting what a kanji character means and pulling up your dictionary app, but from the way it's phrased, it makes it sound like she's relying on Google Translate. Which is... embarrassing.

I don't know whether to laugh or cry. On one hand, this makes me feel better about my own Japanese skills, because if someone like her can live in Japan, then it should be a piece of cake for me to visit! But on the other hand, she's not helping the whole "dumb/lazy American" reputation we have abroad.

I can't watch those "foreigner living in Japan!!" Youtuber vlogs for this exact reason... they like to talk about how they know so much about the culture and language, but then they make an off-handed comment like that and you realize they don't know as much as they think they do. The worst is when they can barely pronounce the words, or put emphasis on the wrong part of the word... it drives me insane...
lusentoj[personal profile] lusentoj on September 10th, 2017 07:54 pm (UTC)
I keep finding these people. EVERYWHERE!! My wife's childhood (online) friend has been living in Japan for 6 years now and still only knows veeeeeery basic Japanese (she even goes on dating sites and dates Japanese guys in English: meaning they're just like silent for the whole date). Was "friends" with an American on Twitter for a while who's been living in Japan for around 9 years and they're somehow barely at N2 level (apparently), I'm certainly going to be passing their level very soon. These guys are in fact living there so they know tons of words I don't (ex. food and item names, slang) but I guess their overall Japanese and grammar is still a lot weaker....

There's some guys I watch videos from who've been living in Japan for around 20 years and I think they're fine. They're not (usually) perfect at Japanese either, nor have they completely sunk into the culture, but you can at least tell that they UNDERSTAND 90+% of what's going on and they're so used to Japan that they've actually mostly forgotten what being outside of Japan is like so there's not much of that weird bragging stuff that ends up happening (if it happens it's usually bragging about the town they live in instead of the country). With me I also get the comfort that they're out there showing themselves to the world speaking in bad Japanese (some of them even forget "masu" half the time for example) and Japanese people don't care, everyone talks to them happily anyway no matter if it's some super old guy or some highschooler.

Correct pronunciation of one random word/phrase in a foreign language within a ton of English can be really difficult but... uh... yeah. I know exactly what you mean.